The Neat Company Forums

I'm in the process of transferring my data from a 32-bit to 64-bit OS.  I downloaded the Full 64-bit version for NW 4.6.2 SP3 and ran the executable.  As usual it asked if I wanted to check for an updated version.  I was floored when it said an updated version was available (4.7.7) but what surprises me even more is that this "new" version is only available as a Full install and is not compatible with existing data ...

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A new version of NeatWorks is available to download.

The NeatWorks installation has detected that a newer version of the installer package is available. If you wish, you may download this here. Version 4.7.7 is now available.

Please Note: This new version utilizes a new database that offers speed and stability improvements, but is not compatible with data from previous versions of NeatWorks. It is recommended only if you are installing NeatWorks for the first time. Select the appropriate link below.

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So what's up with this new version that will only work with new starts?

EDIT:  What's so different with the database that existing data can't be converted/transferred to this so called "new" database?  Is a different database software being used?

Hi,

The 4.7.7 platform uses SQL compact rather than SQL Express.  We'll be moving to that for all users in version 5.0.  The migration from Express to Compact is quite tricky, so we can't restore previous .nrbak files in 4.7.7.  It will be possible to do this in version 5.0.

If this is what you are expecting us to use, SQL Server Compact 3.5 then I'm not interested in it.

What I am interested in is having the Neat Works installation software ask me if there is a currently installed SQL Server I would like to use and to give me the option to use the installed SQL Server.

One of the reasons for this is I am planning on doing a fresh installation soon of Windows 7 Ultimate (64-bit) and I will be installing SQL Server x64 2008 Standard.

I would like to Reinstall Neat Works and be able configure it to use SQL Server 2008 while at the sametime, preventing it from installing any other instance of SQL server such as 2005 Express or Compact 3.5

A Good software program should always check to see if a program is installed first before attempting to install something which may be older than what is already installed and should give one a choice.

Maybe I should consider giving Xerox a try as they do have their own scanner solution and software.

Mike,

I appreciate the quick response.  Are you able to elaborate what drove the Neat Company in making the decision to change the SQL Server edition?  Will you be using the 2008 version?

The choice to go to SQL Compact was pretty simple - it has mostly caught up with Express from a functionality standpoint, and the stuff that isn't there (notably stored procedures) is relatively easy for us to do in other ways.

Compact is also *much* less of a burden on the end user machine.  The install process is significantly faster and more reliable - it's just an xcopy.  We don't have to worry about multiple side by side instances of SQL, and we don't have to deal with having two services installed on the machine to make the application run.  Application startup time is dropped significantly, and that "Database not Running" dialog is a thing of the past.

While this may prove disappointing for a small number of users who liked SQL Express, the new database format will be a clear improvement for the vast majority of our audience.

Enough wrote

A Good software program should always check to see if a program is installed first before attempting to install something which may be older than what is already installed and should give one a choice.

The software is great and has a great use but is implamentation make it limited. Since two version we are unable to use it unless you switch your computer to MM/DD/YYYY. The export to quicken never worked for the same reason. I don't really care about the internal format as long it is working. I lost 2 times all my data. Personnaly, i would love to see the product generating data in flat file format with pdf (seachable) image.

Please make version 5.0 configurable.

Yes, please make 5.0 configurable.

User configurable scan setting, pdf or otherwise would be great.

As for your saying that the vast majority would prefer SQL Express, Personally, I would prefer SQL Server 2008 Standard Edition which has a big difference in database size limit. I run a 64-bit system and the Standard Edition lets you go beyond the 4 GB limit.

Besides, last I knew SQL Compact edition 3.5 is limited to 32-bit processors. So you are basically telling those of use using 64-bit systems tough luck.

So if a company or user has SQL Server already, you should give them the option of using it instead of making them use the Compact Edition which was basically designed for Mobile Devices and desktops.

According to these two microsoft links SQL Server Compact 3.5 SP1 will run on a 64-bit OS.

http://www.microsoft.com/Downloads/details.aspx?FamilyID=dc614aee-7e1c-4881-9c32-3a6ce53384d9&displaylang=en

http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa983341.aspx

New Features in SQL Server Compact 3.5 Service Pack 1 :

SQL Server Compact can run natively in a 64-bit environment. The affected .msi files are SQL Server Compact 64-bit Runtime (SSCERuntime-ENU.msi) and SQL Server Compact 64-bit Server Tools (SSCEServerTools-ENU.msi). Support for 32-bit .msi files has not changed. Developers who are using ClickOnce deployment for their applications must specify both 32-bit and 64-bit download URLs.

Ah, so they did update processor compatibility. :)

But I still do not like the idea of using the compact version which was degned for Mobile devices & desktops.

I want a more Robust solution, such as being able to go beyond the 4 GB database size. 2008 Standard Edition fits this need.

Hi,

The 4 GB limit on an individual database has been true of every database implementation we've used so far.  That's why we have 10 separate image databases.

The capacity of the SQL Compact edition is going to be just the same as the current SQL Express version.

Hope that helps to clear up any confusion.

A couple of questions:

1. Where is 4.7.7?  Im running 4.6.2 on Windows 7 Enterprise x64 RTM.  Ive tried updating from the app however it doesnt find any updates.

2. When is version 5 expected to be released?  Is there a beta version?

3. Will I be able to migrate my data from 4.6.2 to version 5?

Thanks. 

Hi,

4.7.7 is not available as an update path from 4.6.2, nor do we intend to release it as such.  It is intended only as a full install for people without pre-existing NeatWorks data.  4.6.2 and earlier users will migrate to the new DB architecture with the 5.0 release.

Version 5.0 will be sometime in Q4.  It is not available for public beta at this time.

The 4.6.2 -> 5.0 upgrade path will preserve your data.